news, articles and Billy ramblings was that it's a multi-purpose device
and not a multifunctional. In other words, variety - not simultaneously?
So if you're playing games on it, you wouldn't be using the other parts
of it at all - they'd go more dormant at least until they found a way to
stream things down behind the scenes - as you mentioned it won't do
that with current settings in the MS 360 OS. But there are expansion
ports that could be used on the console to 'plug-in' IPTV tuners that
take the workload, partition the bandwidth properly, etc. And, of course,
each TV needs a 360 - that's MS's drooling point. You need a receiver
for Sat & Cable now on each TV used, you'd need a 360 then. MS
has kitten just thinking about selling that many units.
My point is the multi-functional aspect, including the IPTV, is actually
better for all of us in the long run. Right now it's console wars, that
would mean console domination - guaranty that all development houses
would put out a copy of a game for the 360 because it has the potential
to reach not only straight console-players but also all those IPTV homes
as well. And no one's waiting, 2-3 360's in a house like cable boxes
means that game gets played somewhere in there - thus people buy
more. MS would be a fool not to get things to this stage, it's free money.
I'd liken it to the 360 Pro, 360 Elite and what would be the 360 IPTV
version. Bigger HDD, but you could buy the parts (or lease them) from
your IPTV provider to turn your 360 into an IPTV version - just like we
can bop from 20GB to 120 GB and add-on format drives like the defunct
HD-DVD (not MS's fault). If you don't want IPTV - you buy a console.
If you want IPTV, you buy that version or lease it from your IPTV
provider. Gamers-only can remain just that, A/V junkies can move up
if they want.
On Fri, Apr 18, 2008 at 12:05 PM, Alex Atkin <yahoo@maewhitman.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> On Friday 18 April 2008 15:38:34 PSCG Cleveland wrote:
> > Overall, I'll give you it's not (now) a DVR. But it IS a video on
> > demand system,
> > so from the rumblings I've found the thoughts aren't to have you load the
> > sucker with anything you want - but to have the entire library on
> > download-on-demand. So if you wanted to see American Chopper - you go
> order
> > it up and it d/l's so that it's there when you're ready to watch. A DVR in
> > that sense.
> >
>
> Ah of course, that makes sense. The only catch being it would have to stop
> downloading while you are on Live just like marketplace downloads.
>
> Shame that background downloading with the console off is such a waste of
> time
> though as being able to do that while the console is not spinning its fans
> would be useful.
>
>
> > And DVR's today, such as the Sci Atlanta HD-DVR... suck royally? Stable?
> > I haven't seen a clear HD picture from even Time Warner in a long time,
> the
> > more they cram in there the more they downgrade the signal to fit into
> > their bandwidth availability and we get waves and far worse - even on the
> > DVR. So I can't go with ya there, DVR's are no better than what the 360
> > 'could' do.
> >
>
> Hahaha, I didn't say DVRs were stable - they surely aren't. I was saying
> that
> a game console playing a game while recording a HD programme in realtime
> would be even worse.
>
>
> > 3-Core AMD and a 500Ghz GPU and you're saying it can't play any games
> > and record simultaneously? I'll be the first to admit it wouldn't be the
> > best quality and one of the two would tend to suffer but the 360's doing
> > background downloads now during gameplay. 'Bout the only place you'd hit
> > walls would be online in a heavy game (GoW, CoD4, etc.) while trying to
> > suck something down. Otherwise I've stacked video and more to download
> > while playing titles both on and offline. Totally disagree with you there,
> > the stupid thing does it right now as we speak.
> >
> > Only reason the 360 doesn't 'record' is because there's no programming
> > for it? It downloads, that's recording to the HDD. So you instead have it
> > snag and record to the HDD realtime if it were a DVR. I'm not getting how
> > you're saying it can't do it or it's impossible when it does all this now
> > as it sits - worst it'd need is a plug-in independent IPTV tuner to allow
> > recording to occur while gameplay happens? Little box with a CPU/GPU that
> > plugs into USB or expansion ports to take any pressure of the main CPU/GPU
> > like we do on PC's? It's all possible, plausible, reality in some cases
> > and awaiting programming in others. I said DVR in the sense that Cable and
> > Sat need to 'tune' to channels to record. IPTV's totally different, but
> > actually
> > easier to manipulate!
> >
>
> I guess I was getting my lines crossed. What I meant was it couldn't do it
> at
> the sort of bitrates you get on cable, sattelite, over the air or fibre
> broadband. As it is now I haven't heard anyone get the 360 download much
> over 500K/s even if they have 10/20Mbit broadband. This is likely by design
> as once you start hitting higher bandwidth than that its likely to be
> stealing CPU cycles and causing hard drive latency that would interfere with
> gameplay.
>
> Sure it could still be done, but it would really be detrimental to gameplay
> and they aren't going to want to intentionally release a service that would
> do that. They obvious are paranoid about that seeing as background downloads
> stop when you go on live in any way shape or form, even when you know it
> could handle it or for updating leaderboards which clearly it wouldn't be
> problem.
>
>
> > On the IM's, See I haven't noticed a major lag beyond the initial sign-in
> > to XBL with that. Of course I have MSNIM for the most part and my
> > dance card on there isn't loaded with 1,500 people either. If you've got
> > a load of folks on yours, could possibly be why it's lagging out. I fully
> > agree that sucks all the way around, regardless of quantity if that's all
> > that's causing that issue.
> >
> > And no one says you'd have to use the 360 as a multi-function? You'd
> > still have the chance to buy one outright and use it as just a regular
> game
> > console - but the pricing and support should get better because now you
> > have 10X the consoles out there thanks to the IPTV operators using them?
> >
>
> I'm not saying its a bad thing, in fact I am one of the people who likes my
> console to do as much as possible - even if I do not use all those features.
> However if those features are detrimental to its game-playing ability then I
> do object to them.
>
> Alex.
>
>
>
> > On Thu, Apr 17, 2008 at 7:46 PM, Alex Atkin <yahoo@maewhitman.com> wrote:
> > > A DVR/games console is certainly what I would consider the WORST idea.
> > > Microsoft are aware of this I am sure which is why Windows Home Server
> > > was invented. Well that and to make a lot more money for something you
> > > can do for free with Linux.
> > >
> > > Firstly, from what I have read the 360 is NOT a DVR, it is an IPTV
> > > client. You can watch streaming TV but you can't record it. Makes sense
> > > because there's no way it could record a TV programme while playing a
> > > game, even if it could it wouldn't be advisable as they would interfere
> > > with each other. I am only just now risking doing heavy stuff on my
> Linux
> > > machine while also having it setup as a DVR. However while recording
> > > something important I certainly wouldn't run a game on it. When it comes
> > > to multitasking, even a dedicated device struggled. Your average
> > > dedicated DVR is hardware rock-solid stable at it. Everyone I know has
> > > had problems with it. Even the tightly-closed BSkyB PVR boxes in the UK
> > > (their custom software for use only with their sattelite service) are
> > > pretty unreliable. Its not until I got the HD box that it finally
> > > recorded correctly 99% of the time, the SD box would lockup about once a
> > > week without warning requiring a power cycle. So yeah, you see what I
> > > mean.
> > >
> > > Even worse, just look at how much more lag simply being signed in to
> > > messenger puts on the 360 and that really shouldn't need much bandwidth
> > > or CPU time. I had read that while the 360 is 3 core at 3.2Ghz its
> > > nowhere near as powerful as a dual-core Intel at about half that speed
> > > because its based on the old PowerPC architecture - which is why Apple
> > > switched to Intel.
> > > So like traditional game consoles, its REALLY good at concentrating on a
> > > single application (ie the game) but its not so brilliant at
> > > multitasking. The sheer slowness of the blade system in certain games,
> > > the fact some games you were able to crash the 360 if you brought up the
> > > blade while loading, especially while entering a game on live - would
> > > seem to backup this.
> > >
> > > So yeah, I do not think the 360 would work as a PVR nor would any games
> > > console. Its all well and good being able to play movies or even surf
> the
> > > web on the 360. However doing something more CPU/HD intensive AND
> playing
> > > games at the same time, its just not practical as it will ALWAYS cause
> > > problems. This applies equally to the PS3 or any console.
> > >
> > > Alex.
> > >
> > > On Thursday 17 April 2008 19:45:03 PSCG Cleveland wrote:
> > > > Maybe I'm just gettin too damn old (finally) then, I'd welcome a
> > > > multi-purpose console that could allow me to kill crap for a few
> hours,
> > > > kick back and watch some DVR'ed mindless crap and lemme pop in to
> check
> > > > my Gmail every once in awhile? One simple, fixed cost unit. And the
> > > > side bonus... if I was leasing it from AT&T (not buying it) then THEY
> > > > gotta replace the sucker when it toasts out! And a 720 comes out? No
> > > > problem - take my 360 out and gimme the 720 instead. Just pay for it
> > > > over time on the lease vs. dumping everything into the hardware. AT&T
> > > > pays for that, we support the software industry instead like the
> > > > original XBox gameplan thinking went.
> > > >
> > > > Again, maybe that's just me these days vs. those who want a game
> > > > console and that's about it in one device.
> > > >
> > > > On Thu, Apr 17, 2008 at 2:40 PM, PogoWolf <pogowolf@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > That's why I think the Blu-ray player that M$ keeps telling people
> > > > > won't be on/for the 360 is true.
> > > > > it's not. It'll be for the Xbox 'World' system, that'll have it
> built
> > > > > in, the Wiiimote, web support
> > > > > and all the other stupid bull shit that no one cares about on a Game
> > > > > machine.
> > > > >
> > > > > On Thu, Apr 17, 2008 at 2:37 PM, PSCG Cleveland
> > > > > <pscgcleveland@gmail.com>
> > > > >
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > That's one concept that came to my mind, ya... And I'm tellin ya,
> > > > > > they ain't done with MSTV (formerly WebTV) by a longshot either.
> > > > > > This type of device they keep saying PC and 360 continually, but
> > > > > > yet the references are leaning toward the 'game console' end of
> > > > > > things.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Thu, Apr 17, 2008 at 2:33 PM, PogoWolf <pogowolf@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > > > > > > I one handed Wiimote?!
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > On Thu, Apr 17, 2008 at 2:29 PM, PSCG Cleveland
> > > > >
> > > > > <pscgcleveland@gmail.com>
> > > > >
> > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > OK...
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Not only read thsi quick blurb, but LOOK at the picture.
> > > > > > > > THEN... click
> > > > >
> > > > > on
> > > > >
> > > > > > > > the image and start reading down the patent filing they
> > > > > > > > granted. Tell
> > > > >
> > > > > me
> > > > >
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > line ain't blurred! Hah!
> > > > >
> > > > >
> http://www.engadget.com/2008/04/17/microsoft-patent-application-shows
> > > > >-off -wearable-mouse-concept/
> > > > >
> > > > > > > > --
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> > > > > > > PogoWolf with
> > > > >
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> > > > >
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> > > > > > > ==============================
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> > > > > > > http://pogowolf.wordpress.com (Personal Blog)
> > > > > > > Http://www.GamersVue.com (Video Game news, and information)
> > > > > > > Http://Computer911.wordpress.com (Computer/Programming/How to
> > > > > > > Blog) http://www.cafepress.com/pogowolf (The PogoStore.. Bring
> > > > > > > out the Pogo in you)
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> > > > >
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> > > > > with the red roses?
> > > > > ==============================
> > > > > The Pogowolf
> > > > > http://pogowolf.wordpress.com (Personal Blog)
> > > > > Http://www.GamersVue.com (Video Game news, and information)
> > > > > Http://Computer911.wordpress.com (Computer/Programming/How to Blog)
> > > > > http://www.cafepress.com/pogowolf (The PogoStore.. Bring out the
> Pogo
> > > > > in you)
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>
>
>
>
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